And now we come to the house that causes more furrowed brows than any other. It’s bad enough that we have difficulties with the 12th house when it involves the natal chart, but it often is downright cruel when we’re trying to negotiate it’s slippery slopes in a composite. It confuses us, as is appropriate with a house that Neptune rules. We feel it has a nebulous, yet mysteriously powerful influence on our lives when we have planets there, even though we can’t quite fathom the type of influence it wields–are we being seduced to a precipitous cliff by external forces, or are the demons within driving us to the edge? Whatever the motive, we know we are facing some sort of extreme–and a choice.
One thing is certain, and that is planets in the 12th house don’t behave like any other. The 12th house is the culmination of all that has come before it–it’s our last chance, our last ride, and planets there can often go to extremes without knowing why (they can blame it on the limitless nature of Pisces, which respects no boundaries). Planets in the 12th can behave in one of several ways. Either the energy of the planet is lost, confused, diffused and (at least in our early years) ineffective, or the planet can completely embody its archetype for all to see, often after overcoming great difficulties and reversals, sometimes in extreme circumstances. The house is famous for being the house of ‘self-undoing’, but it can also be the house where we find our fame and fortune. The twelfth house is about vocation, our divine calling, and is a very different energy from the status-oriented tenth. Fame has its roots in the 12th because that is where we can serve as an example of a prime archetype–we can embody the zeitgeist of our age. We move from the personal world, giving up our individuality along the way, to become a plaything of the collective unconscious.
What the twelfth house demands of us always is that we give the ego a rest, but often challenges regarding the ego are exactly what we have to face with twelfth house planets. We feel that our twelfth house planets don’t ‘work’ the way our other planets do, or the way that same planet seems to behave in other people’s charts. Sometimes the twelfth house energies become lost, and we create false gods from what we cannot find within us (for example, those with Leo on the 12th house cusp may worship creative expression, but not be able to find it in themselves). A recent class in assassins revealed that the victims often had many planets in the shooter’s 12th house. There is, without a doubt, an element of longing in the 12th. This is the empty space, the place where we are not like others, the place where the pieces don’t fit. And this is where we must reach out beyond our small lives to touch the greater life that is possible.
Now, what to think of this powerful symbolism in the composite chart?
Like individuals with 12th house planets, couples with a lot of twelfth house may feel that there is something fated about their lives together. Something is whispering in their ears. It is not so much a question of choice, more that the universe has chosen for them to be together (at least, that’s what it feels like). It’s a bit like getting knocked off your feet by a powerful wave–you and your partner are going to have to swim in the tide for a while, and deal with whatever watery beasties swim your way. I”ve seen couples with a heavy 12th house influence utterly befuddled and bedazzled by their lives (which don’t go the way their friends’ lives go). It isn’t that they’re unhappy–no, they seem to go more the extreme of bliss altering with despair. On the one hand “We are meant to be…” on the other, “But if we are, why is it so hard?”
When a couple has planets, or an important planet, in the 12th, it can go a couple of ways. One, that planet’s energy can be confused and diffused in their lives, especially when in difficult aspect to other things in the composite. You don’t want, on the whole, a composite Mars in the 12th square to Neptune, unless you are missionaries or you plan to open up a swimming pool installation company. It usually indicates that there is something karmic surrounding that planet that needs fixing–it is, in a prior life, something that was missed or misused between them. It’s the last chance to get it right, and there will be a struggle to use this planet’s positive expression easily. In contrast, couples who come together to create something for the collective often have the appropriate planets in the composite 12th, there for all to see. (One expression does not contra-indicate the other.)
This ‘last chance’ element, sadly, often leads us to relationships that are destined to exist only to fix this thing–when the lesson is learned, both these people move on. It often indicates couples who seem to have a lot of shared experience and shared history–even if they are new to one another, it feels ‘old.’ They recognize one another when they meet. They seem bonded before a word is spoken. We romanticize all of this (and well, a little romance never hurt anyone) but the truth is that this familiarity is there to ‘hurry up’ the bonding process so that the lessons and the challenges can be quickly assimilated. These are the couples who are magnetically attracted to one another and who, after making the necessary commitments, find themselves on strange and unfamiliar territory.
Couples where the 12th is strong can often experience–well, let’s say it–Neptunian weirdness. Telepathy, visiting one another out of body, lucid dreaming where they communicate with one another, strange psychic links and melding of the two energetic bodies. (You can have this without the 12th of course, but the 12th is inclined to it.) This can happen in composites of unrequited love, where one person loves another who doesn’t know he or she exists. Now, you can either say it’s karma, or you can say that person A is psychologically hooking onto the archetype formed with person B’s chart, but whatever it is, it can be a very powerful pull. I’m not quick to say its an illusion, but it’s not quite ‘real’ either, and you can get into some dangerous territory in the 12th by telling yourself things that aren’t really true. The weirdness of the 12th usually happens when one or both of the other parties has a heavy 12th influence in the natal.
Again, sadly, this being the 12th, most of the time the lesson is learning to love and then let go. Neptune’s great teaching is that love is a powerful force in and of itself, and should not be used as a binder. Neptune, as the higher octave of Venus, is all about connections, and the 12th house allows us to dissolve the boundaries of ordinary life in order to reach out beyond our mundane reality. Those of us with composite 12th emphasized will be asked to step away from the mundane and step into the world of the extraordinary, where unlikely connections are day to day things. Sometimes we will be asked to make leaps of faith. Oftentimes, once we surrender to the powers of the 12th house, our lives are transformed by meaning, because those unlikely connections have brought us a wisdom beyond our time together. Eventually, we learn that life is not as random as we thought, but full of purpose and meaning. It may have felt like chaos, but later on we know that there was method to the madness.
Couples with a heavy 12th house/ 6th house polarity have to find a way to put their wisdom to some practical use. It often helps to work together on projects they find meaningful, or to spend some time doing community or charity work. Once they have hammered out their imbalance (too little, too much is often a theme with the 12th) they must find a way to make something real of their inspiration. Find a way to bring the god down to the day to day world, so that it, too, is considered sacred. It’s a huge task, but often one the 12th house couple is uniquely suited for.
You may now be more confused about the 12th house than you were at the beginning of this piece, but such is the nature of the 12th, beautiful and terrible. We are fated, but we are meant to part. We have a meaningful journey to take together, but we must ultimately be alone. Our lives are silly and sublime at once. We have the ultimate intimacy side by side with the knowledge of ultimate separateness. We grasp for the handrail, and find nothing to hold on to. We fall, and find the world.
Thanks for this very interesting article about that controversial 12th house… and I totally agree with your final paragraph. After I read and then I re-read this was the conclusion – that I am more confused than before but more peaceful and more tolerant with my fate. It was helpful all of your comments about the rest of composite houses and I say “Thank you” again for this…
I live a “bliss and despair” relation for about 2 years… but definite we are totally different persons than before met each other (we are old enough!). We have a composite Pisces Ascendant (3°) with a Pisces Saturn in 12 conjunct Ascendant. More, we have a 5 cluster Scorpio in 9 (Moon, Venus, Neptune, Jupiter and Mercury), a composite Sun in Sag in 10, with Pluto and Uranus conjunct in 7 and unaspectted Gemini NN in 4… we also have a lot of 6/12 house contacts in synastry and 21 conjunctions (far from being easy!)
We are from different countries and we live “bliss” for few moments and then a lot of despair and pain separated without any logic… A tough road between Heaven and Hell!… but that’s life afterall!
With a lot of respect for all of your work and wishing you all the best
Hello Lumi!
I know this post is from a decade ago… and that Dawn is gone… but I just found it and I have a very similar situation… with someone I first met 20 years ago…
Saturn and Chiron in the 12th.
Asc in Pisces, stellium in the 9th in Scorpio:
Sun, Venus, Neptune, Jupiter.
Moon in Scorpio in the 8th. Pluto and Uranus conjunct in 7 .
How did that work out for you?
Were your mutual feelings ever in the open, or was it all under a hot carpet?
Have you found lasting peace?
I hope so!
If you read this I’d appreciate to hear from you.
Many blessings your way, and much gratitude to Dawn who is still inspiring, wherever she is ♥️
This is brilliant and compassionate.
Thank you.
Thank you for this piece – it is prompting reflection. What of mother-daughter pairs? Your post was seemed most fitting for a romantic liaison. Anything different there? My daughter and I have a 12th house Sun-Moon conjunction (in Cancer) in our composite. Sadly, our Moon is square to Uranus – and I suspect this might be one influence behind her decision to break off all contact with me. That was over three years ago. Guess our trines from Sun/Moon to Jupiter aren’t enough to off set.
Judy, I’m sorry about your relationship with your daughter. The 12th house conjunction in Cancer indicates that there is a nurturing issue between you that needs resolving. And yes, with Uranus squaring, the tendency would be to want to break away rather than face what is wrong. I’m also sorry to say that trines aren’t all they’re cracked up to be–sometimes they just pour energy into whatever else they’re aspecting, in this case, the major square. (Note that Jupiter is the natural co-ruler of the 12th, so it will behave in a Pisces-like manner, here.) But I think you can count on that Jupiter for evoking good will between you should you decide to reconcile.
So beautifully written Dawn. You explain the ineffable.
My sun in the 3rd is squeezed in a T-square between Saturn in Pisces, in the 6th and Pluto/Uranus in Virgo, in the 12th. The empty space you decribe has me under pressure most days.
My life seems to cycle in and out of being able to bring that 12 house/Neptune energy into the everyday world.
Lord knows I do drive myself crazy with lost love/unrequited love. Entering through my dreams, plenty of astral seduction going on out there in the ethers. That 12th house/Neptune influence is devasting if left unchecked.
Looking forward to taking more classes with you in the future,
Warmly,
Tricia
Thank you, Tricia. Your generation, the one with Pluto/Uranus opposite Saturn in Virgo/Pisces, came into this life with a huge burden. The higher powers are always tapping at the door, insisting on change, cleansing, and renewal from within (Pluto/Uranus in Virgo), but how do you do that if your connection to the ‘other’ world and the higher powers are full of fear and resistant to the necessary dissolving that must occur (Saturn in Pisces). If the fears aren’t dealt with (and the fears include loss of all kinds), it can get projected and the world itself can become the enemy. Look at poor Kurt Cobain, who is the poster boy for this aspect. Great gifts are possible if that Saturn is respected–the power of manifesting energy into form. We become real magicians if we can tap into it. In order to respect this aspect, we need to have reverence for all the cycles of life, not just the upswing.
Thank-you Dawn,
your comments really hit home.
Thanks for the kind and helpful words, Dawn. Bright blessings to you.
I found composite Saturn on the 12th house, trining the composite Sun/Venus/Merc on the 8th and sextile to the Moon on the 2nd. Saturn is the heaviest aspected planet in this composite, which actually reinforces the intensity of the Moon/Saturn-opposite theme from synastry.
Definitely karmic and unbreakable. The fatedness of it all doesn’t make sense at times, like union of the subconscious.
Hi Dawn,
Oh wow, I’m glad to be reading this after the fact. An ex-lover and I share composite Sun/Mercury in the 12th. We communicated telepathically and still do. We met one day and it was ON, mutual, and understood without saying word. Felt and feels karmic, but alas, it was definitely not meant to be….for now. We are still friends and we’ll always love each other. There is still a sense that anything can happen though, very unpredictable energy.
One valuable lesson I learned is to refrain being attached to an outcome with him.
As a 12th house person, I finally realized I enjoy the confusion.
Thanks for the excellent read. 😀
Learning to become unattached to outcome is a Neptunian theme in general.
my davison chart has our sun, mercury and pluto in the 12. frequently i hear what he says in my head before he says it.
the davison chart also has our moon, venus, saturn and uranus in the 1st. and then mars, Jupiter and neptune in the 2nd.
clearly the 1st has the most planets, but you said the sun was the essence of the chart,its in scorpio in the 12 house. but the rising is scorpio. i don’t know, looking at this chart, it has completely different emphasis, from my regular composite.
what do you think it means to have such much weight in the 1st and 12th houses?
Hi ame–Now we’re talking about the differences between the Davison and the midpoint charts, and that’s really too complicated a topic to go into here. Let’s put it this way–the Davison chart is a time/space chart; it’s reality is anchored in the actual midpoint between the times of birth and places of birth. The midpoint composite points out the places where the planets in the two charts manifest. In my experience, the Davison chart reveals more of the ‘day to day’ reality, and the midpoint chart reveals the inner working dynamic. I use both in my practice.
Thank you for writing this article!
I have read at least books regarding the 12th house, and it’s not easy to comprehend the needs of the 12th.
Natal Sun in Gemini and Venus in Cancer in the 12th, and Venus is conjunct my Cancer ASC. It has been a very long journey!
NAMASTE!
oh gosh do not i know this! I met this men who i recall seeing 20 years ago once and a couple of other times within that 20 years. Subconciously I always looked at him for a few seconds like a magnet but did not put any thought to it. This year in April we were introduced to each other by our mates. How ironic! We are both married similar age kids. But from the first moment I felt and I know he did as well this very big attraction to him. I felt (sorry to say) that he is the big love of my life! I could love this man more than my husband who is a caring man and in a way very similar to this man. Long story short it really bothered me that I can not tell him how I really feel about him because we are both ironically attending church but I felt that he really likes me as well. So I had to find an answer without destroying so many other lives or breaking up relationships. I turned to astrology and within months I learnt a lot of things about this topic. I am not an expert but this artical ssure proves the writer of it right! And here is why: my sun, mercury and venus and chiron is in th e 12th natal house. His sun, mercury and chiron is in the 12 house in his natal chart. In Our composite chart Sun, Mercury, Venus, Jupiter and Chiron in the 12 house. We both experienced he physically (I think) something weird when i was very close to him and I saw something mind boggling in the night when Venus turned retrograde this year. 4 months passed since then. We talk with each other and I know he loved me and still does like me , we talk in the church when we can but none of us really telling the real story (which is so 12 house thing). And they might move next year to another town because of their son so I am already dying from the thought that I will not see him after that. As the article says : “this being the 12th, most of the time the lesson is learning to love and then let go”. And it KILLS ME! I still could love this man with his faults which I know he has but he is so caring and nice. I like my husband as well after 20 years of marriage but I feel like I fell in this tragic love triangle story without asking for it! I feel so helpless! I know he is devoted to his son more maybe than to his wife but he cares about him as well because he is a very nice man. I am so sad because I would have never meet him IF my husband and this man, and his wife would not become friends with him in church, ( I did not go to church for a while so I would not meet them!) If I did not believe in Karma or Fate now I do not have ANY DOUBT that really something runs our life from out there for good or bad
” such is the nature of the 12th, beautiful and terrible.”! @ more very amazing thing IF this is still not enough proof: My Moon and Mars conjucts his North Node (fairly tight 2-3 degrees conjuction) His NOrth Node conjucts His own Pluto (good old Pluto might just kill me with his north node conjuction (i wonder if that is the plan here?) And 1 more thing HIS VENUS opposes my vertex and my sun, venus and mercury on his ASC conjucts his Venus! IF THIS IS NOT A TRAGIC LOVE STORY THAN WHAT IS? Please can someone find me some positive end result here because I have not too much hope after reading that article aboyt the 12 house and I am going insane because I can not really tell anyone what is going on in my life> (husband, kids or even him)I do not want to hurt anybody’s life but that means I have to give up my love which is just to hurtful to do! Talking about Fate! Well it is a living hell right now!
I’m sorry to hear your story. I’m sure a lot of my readers have been there and sympathize with you completely. Ultimately, both the 12th house and Neptune want us to get our egos out of the way. The lesson they teach is that we do not have to possess love in order to experience it. They help us understand that our capacity to love is its own reward.
thanks Dawn for your reply. I have to come to grips with it (what you said) altough it is not an easy thing for me when it comes to love (being an Aries lol I want to love with a passion and not just except it as an idea). Sure someone up there wants to teach me a lesson (again!). thanks Dawn! If anything new would happen you would dbe the first one to know! 🙂
I really love this article its very beautifully written and bittersweet, but anyone with a natal 12th house venus and venus in pisces has walked these roads. But I do have one question? How does a Composite Sun or Ruler of the chart operate when their planets are in the 12th house but also also conjunct the Ascendant?
This is a complicated question and needs a subtle analysis in the chart, but on the whole, planets in the first house side of the angle center around the development of a healthy sense of Self, of ego, whereas planets on the 12th house side of the angle will be dealing with karma surrounding ego choices, and the planets will take on a more archetypal energy and effect. In other words, that planetary energy might have to do with dealing with their collective, rather than personal, expression. The 12th house has to do with summarizing and accepting all that has come before it, whereas first house planets are very pure, almost innocent, in their expression.
Thank you for this series of articles! I really appreciate your take on the 12th house; it definitely resonates as true, from my experience. The composite chart with the man I’m involved with has an extremely tight Moon/Mars conjunction in the 12th, along with the North Node. The Moon/Mars (Virgo) sextiles a close Sun/Jupiter (Cancer) conjunction in the 10th, sextiles Uranus (Scorpio) in the 2nd, trines Ceres (Capricorn) in the 4th, and squares Neptune (Sagittarius) in the 3rd – all very close aspects.
I’m trying to determine the karmic lessons we need to learn from this. Any insights you may have would be greatly appreciated!
The interesting thing is that we have a very unconventional relationship, mainly as friends and close allies in a spiritual cause (with the mission of saving the world, essentially), but with a new dimension of intense emotional and physical intimacy. We see each other regularly in our spiritual activities, and yet live on opposite coasts, and though dedicated to each other 100% as spiritual allies (and possibly more), we have no intentions of giving up our day-to-day independence.
Overall the chart has a heavy emphasis on the 10-12 houses, and no planets at all in the 5-9 houses, with the exception of Chiron in the 8th house (which sextiles the MC and trines the Moon/Mars as well). All this seems to confirm your analyses of the other composite houses, as well.
We also have composite Juno in Aquarius in the 4th house (opposing Mercury in the 10th and trining the Ascendant), and Venus tightly conjunct Saturn in the 11th (Leo). From what you said, it seems like perhaps these give the relationship an element of commitment, partnership, and longevity that it wouldn’t otherwise have – albiet in an unusual, community-oriented way. What do you think?
The only way that you can figure out the main issue of karma in a relationship is to examine the nature of both Nodes and their rulers in the Composite, along with aspects to the Nodes. Saturn and Pluto also play their part. I don’t have enough information, but the chart emphasis leads me to believe that you are right in your analysis, that the partnership finds its life in the upper houses.
Hi Daw
I read once if someone’s pluto is attached to his own north node that would mean if the person puts anything between himself and “god” he will loose it, because that is what Pluto teaches. Do you think that is true? And would that mean -let’s say- if this person’s partner’s personal planets conjuncts to his north node would he lose the partner or would he lose “god” because he put that person (her planets) between himself and “god”! I never understood that statement could you put some light on it for me? Thanks!
Hi anna–My feeling is that the word ‘god’ is loaded, psychologically speaking. We all find our gods where we can and must. I like to think of Pluto more in terms of the battle between the ego and the soul. We all have things we come in to this life to accomplish, achieve, or learn. (Or so we believe, those of us who deal in astrology.) Sometimes the ego gets in the way of our path, whether through fear, resistance to growth, resistance to break old habits and personal tendencies, or through a lack of interest in what is wanted of us. To use Jeff Green’s analogy, the ego believes it is an independent entity, but a developed ego is like a wave; it knows it is moving towards the shore, but it also knows that it will return to the ocean to which it belongs, the place of the Source or universal spirit. We need strong, healthy egos to accomplish what we’ve come to do in this life, but we need to act according to what is wanted of us, not against it. If we do things out of fear or for security, and we don’t listen to the call to step onto our proper path in life, we are serving the ego instead of the soul. We are ignoring what the Source is asking us to do.
Sometimes the path isn’t easy to find, and we make lots of mistakes along the way. We go down a lot of wrong alleyways. This is okay, as long as we learn from those mistakes and adjust our steps. Sometimes learning from the mistakes IS the path. (Our North Node rulers often lead us down these blind alleyways.) When Pluto is conjunct the North Node, our mistakes can be more dramatic and our adjustments have to be greater. Usually, life will present us with huge dilemmas that cause us to choose between the ego and the soul path. When synastry presents itself on the Pluto/Node conjunction, the partner to the Pluto person will instigate growth, either from a negative or positive stimulus. The Pluto struggle with the ego and power will engage with the partner’s planets–in a positive way, the partner can become a guide. In a negative way, the struggles within the partnership will cause the Pluto person to see where his or her behaviour needs adjusting. Whether the energy between them manifests positively or negatively has to do with aspects to Pluto in both charts and aspects with the North Node rulers.
thanks you very much Dawn to shed some lights on this! Now I just have to sit and wait around where it is got to leave us! You are great!!!!!!!!!!!
Hi Dawn,
You mentioned that couples with 12th house emphasis usually come together for a specific purpose and once that is completed the relationship is destined to end (that’s what I gathered anyway).
My fiance and I have an exact conjunction of Sun/Mercury in the 12th in Taurus – with Venus also being the chart ruler and placed in the 1st. North Node conjuncts Desc. along with Juno.
(Continued) – and Moon on Desc. as well.
My natal chart ruler is the Moon and his natal chart ruler is Mars. My natal Venus conjuncts composite IC and his natal Mars conjuncts composite MC. In our synastry my North Node/South Node axis is conjunct his MC/IC axis and his Moon conjuncts my IC.
My question is this: Does our Sun/Mercury conjunction in the 12th composite necessarily have to mean we are destined to learn a particular lesson and then part? I feel that our connection is a long term one over many lifetimes. I feel like I never want tk part from this man.
Hi HG–Of course, these articles can’t contain every single exception, and the whole chart has to be taken into consideration. It isn’t every case that the couple with a strong 12th house will break up. But there will be some crisis where they have to define their love and anchor it some useful purpose. Love for love’s sake won’t fly with the 12th house. You have a strong synastry and a strong 1st house in the composite, and of course that makes a difference.
Thank you Dawn!
We have an interesting stellium in the 6th – Uranus, Eros, Ceres, and Vertex – all within a degree of each other. I don’t quite know what it all means but I like what you wrote here and will keep it in mind for future reference:
[Couples with a heavy 12th house/ 6th house polarity have to find a way to put their wisdom to some practical use. It often helps to work together on projects they find meaningful, or to spend some time doing community or charity work. Once they have hammered out their imbalance (too little, too much is often a theme with the 12th) they must find a way to make something real of their inspiration. Find a way to bring the god down to the day to day world, so that it, too, is considered sacred. It’s a huge task, but often one the 12th house couple is uniquely suited for.]
Is this similar for composite ruler in 12th? The composite AC is Scorpio – Pluto in 12th (only planet) and Mars in 8th. I’d appreciate any information. Beautiful article!!
Thank you for this article.
There is a “certain someone” whose natal Sun is in the 12 th, his sun also receiving a natal square from his Neptune. Well, his descendant point, and his ascendant ruler both conjunct my natal Lilith in my12 th house, orb2°. His venus also opposed my Lilith in XII., his Pluto also trine my lilith in XII.
His Neptune conjuncts my SN orb 0°03
Haunting …
It’s hard for me to stop dreaming about this person.
Illusions…… yes I know.
But the problem with Neptune and XII house synastric connections, is that illusions seem to possess not your brain, but your flesh and soul. If I murdered this illusion, it would be like if I murdered my own soul ; I just can’t . It’s part of me.
With Lilith so deeply involved, this relationship has a direct bearing on your feelings about your sexual power. What you are fascinated by is your own longing to acknowledge and feel this power.
sorry I’ve made an error : it is not “his descendant point”, it is his IC point
Thank you for your answer. Yes it’s probably the case, but as it is unconscious, how could I manage it , or prevent myself from feeling this ? I really feel like there is a wolf howling in a forest at night and I hear his call , I know I am the female wolf and that the call is for me and I have to go to him now. Struggling against our own unconscious is not an easy thing
I have forgotten to say, as for HIS Lilith, it’s conjunct my Desc (orb -1°) which is an interaspect I can’t give meaning to, (too hard to analyse for me) but however, it also is a new “lilith matter”.
Thank you for such an eloquent understanding, this has helped me. Me and my sweet friend have Sun, Venus and Mercury in Cancer in the 12th, trine Neptune in Scorpio in the 5th, sextile Moon in Taurus in the 10th, but square Saturn in Virgo in the 3rd. It has felt fated, mesmerizing, seductive, magnetic – and karmic. I’m blessed to remember some past lives we’ve had and we have definitely come together to mend some old wounds and learn to forgive and love one another. I can honestly say that I love this man from the highest level of my being, but I don’t feel we belong together in a committed relationship. I feel sad about that. It has been a long, hard road, but rewarding– and with the planets in Cancer, SO hard to let go. But thank you for helping me face reality.
I am in a relationship with a man for 14 years in which we have an extremely strong synastry including my saturn conjunct his venus by degree, his saturn/node conjunct my sun/chiron by degree. His Saturn rules his moon and his ascendant, so it is a prominent planet, and as I said, he has Saturn conjunct his north node natally. These are just a few of the synastry aspects. The composite chart has Sun/Jupiter conjunct by degree in the 12th in Scorpio, moon in the 12th in late Libra, and Scorpio rising. Pluto is elevated in the composite chart close to the midheaven in the 9th. Composite north node (Aquarius) trine composite Saturn in Libra (which is conjunct his natal sun). I know this man will be in my life as long as I can imagine. Though many of the things you have said have been true, and there are challenges, I know we are committed to knowing each other and spending this precious time together. The relationship is a very private one, we share many trips together, and special 12th house retreat time together. Both of us are on a spiritual path, which is very important to each of us. I think that your article is quite amazing, but for those of us who are making these relationships work for us I wish you would have given some cases in which it can work. I’ve known couples who are married for long periods of time to have 12th house composites. What is it that makes it work?
Twelfth house composites can work very well if the people involved understand that they must work together and make a contribution of some kind, even to simply show a good example of what a couple can be.
Hi Dawn. Thanks for taking the time to respond. Yes There is a higher purpose to these relationships. Regine.
Hi everyone,
I just met someone who has their moon in 12th house like myself and im wondering if i need to investigate this more closely. I am not certain this person is a fit but yet there are alot of coincidences between us that keeps me boggled on the larger picture. I am a Sag with moon (12th house) and rising both in scorpio. He is a pisces/cap/aquar with cap moon in 12th house. any input would be greatly appreciated!!!
thank you 🙂
Lissa
Hello, Skye. House position isn’t as strong as the sign of the Moon. That you both have the Moon in the 12th makes you both sensitive to your surroundings and highly intuitive. Your emotions may also be cloudy and unclear at times, and your lack of boundaries may cause you trouble. However, Sag and Cap are very, very different from one another and the things that make you feel secure, comforted and appreciated will be very different, unless other things in the chart back them up.
Everything you said is so on point. Thanks Dawn!
Hello,
I have a nice syntrastry with my boyfriend (i’m born 8/1/1983 and he is born 10/7/1982). But, our composite chart is weird. We have our composite sun in 12th house, along with saturn. Sun conj. Saturn and Pluto and Ascedant.
We work together, this relationship is definitely a karmic one, but now, after 1 one year of being together, there are some difficulties.
I know that there is a purpose regarding this relationship, but i can’t find it…
I had a karmic relationship with a guy for 6 years which ended badly. I don’t want to lose this relationship too so I would like to help me to find out the karmic lesson.
(I have my moon in Scorpio in the 12th house along with Saturn and Pluto)
Thank you in advance!
Sorry I can’t get into too much detail here, but if your composite Sun is conjunct Saturn, Pluto and the Ascendant then you can only take comfort in the fact that the relationship is meant to be transforming and spiritually challenging. You will both be changed deeply by it. Good luck.
I became reacquainted with a man I grew up with. The attraction was instant. He told me he had butterflies I did too.his nn is conjunct my ascendant. My nn is conjunct his sun and mercury. Our composite mars is in cancer in the 12 house. His natal Venus in cancer is in my 12house. I’m a Pisces sun 7house. He’s Gemini sun . I love him more than I’ve ever loved any man I knew immediately. He says what on thinking. When we left to go home I literally felt a piece of me inside left. Our composite sun is in the 7 house. I’m trying to figure it out.
“The lesson they teach is that we do not have to possess love in order to experience it. They help us understand that our capacity to love is its own reward.” Very exquisitely put. This resonates with me.
I still remember very clearly how I felt 10 years ago when I first met my former boyfriend. “I have met my match. This man can be my everything and this feeling will not change.” We had an instant connection, and I ended up in his apartment the first night we met. (I have never done anything like that with anyone else.) We have Sun, Mercury, Venus, and Uranus in the 12th house in our composite chart. You can imagine the past 10 years have not been easy. (Not at all helped by the fact that his Venus is square to my Sun at exact degrees.) Instant connection, followed by a break up 5 days after, followed by getting back together 1 week later, on and off, on and off… formally breaking up in 9 months, and yet professing how we never stopped loving each other two years after that… (“If you want to find someone else, if you want to marry someone else, I will not stop you, but know this. I will always be exactly where I am now – loving you. I loved you from the first moment and that has never changed.”) In the 10 years, he (who had been separated from his wife when we first met) went back to his wife, I got engaged to someone else but broke it off realizing I do not love my fiance, reconnected as “just friends”, and I eventually married someone else, with his blessings. I am reasonably happy in my 3+ year marriage, and yet, I still miss my former boyfriend desperately sometimes. We still keep in touch as “just friends” occasionally, and sometimes I feel like I am having conversations with him in my head. I still feel a strong connection to him, but in a way, I guess I have come to reasonable terms with not being with him. Oh the powers of the 12th house. Knowing him has felt like a blessing and a curse, and yet, to this day, I do not regret falling in love with him that night 10 years ago. The feelings I have for him, I feel, are something I just have to live with for the rest of my life.
Dear Down!
We have (taurus) mars-venus conjunction on the 12th house and it is so real in our life: we need so strong the deep intimacy and the so close physical and spiritual nearness together, and it is better for us to be alone together for our happiness. What do You think about Davison Chart? In my opinion the midpoint composite is not really true, because our midpoint chart doesn’t show the very intense physical love what we live together. Our midpoint composit cannot show any true about our relationship. What is the difference between Midpoint and Davison as Your opinion? And what does it mean our 12th. taurus venus-mars conjunction in Your opinion? We feel that very beautiful in our life! Thank You for Your answer and best regards from Hungary! WhiteLotus
so beautiful and so healing especially the last paragraph. Everyword’s pounding in me. Thank you, Dawn.(like your name too.)~~~a reader with Sun in Neptune and Saturn and Mars both in 12th house.
:In a composite chart: What does it mean when both people have juno in the 12 House? Only his Juipter is in the 12th, I have no planets there but also we both also have ceres and lilith in the 12th. RUN …?
As far as the four major asteroids are concerned, I find that house position is not as important as aspect. Juno in the 12th means that there are unresolved issues surrounding equality in relationship and some sort of sacrifice in relationships will be necessary in order to discover that balance. Juno is not only about romantic partnerships, but has to do with equality in general. People who fight for justice for others often have Juno prominent in the chart.
Dear Down!
We have (taurus) mars-venus conjunction on the 12th house and it is so real in our life: we need so strong the deep intimacy and the so close physical and spiritual nearness together, and it is better for us to be alone together for our happiness. What do You think about Davison Chart? In my opinion the midpoint composite is not really true, because our midpoint chart doesn’t show the very intense physical love what we live together. Our midpoint composit cannot show any true about our relationship. What is the difference between Midpoint and Davison as Your opinion? And what does it mean our 12th. taurus venus-mars conjunction in Your opinion? We feel that very beautiful in our life! Thank You for Your answer and best regards from Hungary! WhiteLotus
Hi Whitelotus–I use both the Midpoint and the Davison charts in synastry. They represent different aspects of a relationship. I’m afraid I can’t get into it in this space (in the synastry course, we spend several lessons comparing the midpoint and Davison charts). But on the whole the midpoint chart is a chart about the essence and purpose of a relationship and the Davison chart is more about the external realities of a relationship. I’m sure your midpoint chart is valid if you had it read properly. The Davison chart is a time/space chart and is anchored in the here and now. The midpoint chart reveals the relationship on another level entirely. A Venus/Mars conjunction in Taurus can be a beautiful thing. I’m glad you’re enjoying it.
Dear Dawn, I just see now, that accidentally I typed wrong Your name! VERY-VERY SORRY! Thank You so much for Your answer! Our synastry with my beloved couple is very strong with good connections between both 1th and 7th house rulers and many positive aspects like double whammy saturn-moon, and positive ascendant-moon, ascendant-venus, venus-moon, and so warm and intense pluto conj. venus+mars, etc. so we find the True in each other. The synastry can show the true about our relationship, and the Davison also but less than synastry, but the Composite chart can show almost nothing. I herd that the good connections between the 1st house rulers and 7 th rulers are so important an the good saturn aspects also. Could I ask Your opinion? And I read from Stephen Arroyo that it is so important to see the traditional rulers of the signs , for example in Aquarius is more important to see Saturn than Uranus. Is Your experience the same? Thank You very much for Your answer and very best regards from Hungary again!
Dear Dawn, I just see now, that accidentally I typed wrong Your name! VERY-VERY SORRY! Thank You so much for Your answer! Our synastry with my beloved couple is very strong with good connections between both 1th and 7th house rulers and many positive aspects like double whammy saturn-moon, and positive ascendant-moon, ascendant-venus, venus-moon, and so warm and intense pluto conj. venus+mars, etc. so we find the True in each other. The synastry can show the true about our relationship, and the Davison also but less than synastry, but the Composite chart can show almost nothing. I herd that the good connections between the 1st house rulers and 7 th rulers are so important an the good saturn aspects also. Could I ask Your opinion? And I read from Stephen Arroyo that it is so important to see the traditional rulers of the signs , for example in Aquarius is more important to see Saturn than Uranus. Is Your experience the same? Thank You very much for Your answer and very best regards from Hungary again! Whitelotus
This is my take on signs that have two rulers–there is a higher expression and a lower expression of the sign’s energy. One is more transpersonal and numinous, the other deals with our reactions in the day to day world. Saturn and Uranus both have a lot to say about Aquarius. Mars and Pluto certainly do about Scorpio. And I don’t think you can fully understand Pisces without understanding its relation to Jupiter as well as Neptune. I wouldn’t say that one is more important than another. They have to learn to work together–that’s the challenge. The lower expression has to be elevated, and the higher expression needs to be realized. Two sides of the same coin.
By the way, in progressions, you very clearly see the influence of both planets at work.
Wow, everything in this article is so accurate + written so beautifully. This guy in my life puts Libra venus in my 12th (conjuncting my own Libra venus in 12th). I put mars (Cancer) in his 12th.
In composite, we have sun, mercury and part of fortune in the 12th. (We also have some 4th and 8th house synastry – with me as the planet person, and 3 planets in the composite 4th).
Is it possible that 2 people with so much 12th/water house activity; both within synastry and composite, there is any hope for them to just be normal and happy together without karma or something else getting in the way?
With 4, 8 and 12 emphasized, you’ll have to deal with one another in an emotionally honest way, no matter what karma you have to work out together. Concentrate on intimacy and you should be all right.
hi dawn. what kind of compassion do you think can be generated from a composite mars in 12th house? mars is trine composite sun, pluto, uranus jupiter and neptune- but square moon saturn….
thank you for your insight
thank you !!! you are right on target- although I forgot to mention that our trine is in 4th,8th and 12th 🙂 you are an amazing teacher and your articales on your site have helped me tremendously. MUCH APPRICIATED- i am forever greatful for your insights.
cheers:)
We have a Sun, Venus, Ceres, Node, Lilith and Fortune in 12th house. I am Sun in Aries, Asc in Leo and Moon in Aquarius, and he is Sun in Leo, Asc in Gemini and Moon in Leo. Composite The relationship is deep and beautiful and in periods hard for us to be with each other.
Is there something to be read from this cluster of planets in 12th house?
Thank you very much. I need all the help to understand I can get.
I would like to help you, but you would need a full analysis of the charts to know what is going on with this 12th house energy. When there are clusters of planets there are no simple solutions. Much depends on the relationship of the 12th house planets to one another.
Thank you very much for the answer. I will look into it.
Thank you Dawn for this very interesting article.
Well, I ‘m afraid I am precisely one of those people you talk about in the article , who experiment this weird illusion of being in telepathy with the “unrequired love” of their life. !! Although I’m aware this is only an illusion of my mind and nothing else , this illusion is so strong and so frequent that I ‘ve at least learned to live with it and I’ve given up struggling against it.
And youre so right, because there is something about the compo 12 th house !
The composite with the “Great Unrequired Impossible love of my life” , shows Sun conjunct Neptune and SN , in Scorpio VII . Sun and Neptune both trine Lilith, who is in Pisces AND in house 12.
This compo Pisces Lilith in house 12 falls on the exact degree of my natal Waldemath H58 , and she also falls on his natal antivertex.
Its weird weird weird . One day , you said that people “telegraph” their natal theme at every instant of their lives. I think this is SO true ….
I live in a kind of constant daydream /illusion of being near my “beloved ghost “……I know this is not truth , but I don’t know how I could do without.
Thank you once again for your site
Hi Evelyne. The point is not that the telepathy is an illusion, the point is that it’s real, but it doesn’t matter. It’s not special, it’s common. It’s what happens when a sensitive person loves another human being. Sun conjunct Neptune is a very difficult thing to live with in a composite chart. My sympathies. Also, forgive my double Virgo and the fact that I was once an editor: the phrase is ‘unrequited love’ not ‘unrequired.’ Sorry.
hi dawn
great post- thank you!
….why is neptune conjunct sun so bad in composite?
i have it conjunct in our davison3rd house- and opposite in4th-10th in composite. should i run away from this relationship?!….the telepathy is overwhelming me.
intresting to know why its so bad….
thanks!!
It isn’t bad, it’s difficult. It’s difficult because boundaries dissolve and we find it hard to maintain our separateness, which is necessary in a healthy relationship. Also, if the relationship is not a good one, Sun conjunct Neptune is prone to self-deception and confusion at best and outright deception and betrayal at its worst. Everyone longs for melding and merging in relationship, but the truth is that separateness makes us interesting to one another. Often, Sun/Neptune relationships just fade away or dissolve without anyone knowing why.
hi dawn:)
thank you for post!
we have stellium-sun, venus, mercury in 12th house-composit chart(aries), mars in 11th house, moon in 6th, uran retrograde and pluto retrograte in 5th, jupiter retrograde and neptun retrograde in 7th house, south node conjuct regulus in 4th hause, vertex conjuct DC, saturn in 1th house.
Please your opinion.
(excuse my bad English)
Lots of greetings from Serbia
Sorry, aja, this is too much information to handle in this space. Whatever I told you would not have a context. You need a synastry reading to make sense of all this.
Thank you for your reply Dawn .
I apologize for the mistakes, I’m French and sometimes it is difficult to express in English .
What you said about compo Sun/Neptune is very interesting Please I would like to know Dawn,according to you it is important to notice what this compo Sun/Neptune conjuncts in each individual charts, to determine more precisely how each person is going to “feed” this confusing Sun /Neptune by his/her personal points .? or is it irrelevant ?
Thank you in advance.
Don’t worry, Evelyne. A lot of native speakers make this same mistake, and worse.
And yes, you need to put the natal charts around the composite to see how this is going to affect the individuals.
OK , thank you Dawn for your reply
Ok -thank you for your reply:)
hello, nice article Dawn. I and my boyfriend have conjunction of mars-venus in twelfth house (taurus) closely conjuncting composite gemini ascendant. We are very romantic together and trust each other. But it was very devastating experience getting physical, it really failed the first time and we didn’t try it again.
our composite mars-venus conjunction opposes composite uranus, sun, mercury all conjunct from seventh house. It feels that we are very free together than alone. There are no connections with saturn to make it harsh. composite moon and saturn are in fifth house. Please advise if we can make it to marriage or our relationship is doomed. 🙁
The story of your inability to connect probably has more to do with your individual chart comparisons than the composite chart. The Uranus/Mercury conjunction in the composite can make the relationship more mental than physical. You need to work on bringing body and mind together, as a couple.
Hi!!
Lovely article. Written in 12thouse Neptunian mystique and eloquence 🙂
I was wondering about my composite contacts with some I know who we share 12th house themes with.
*Composite Chiron conjunct Moon in Taurus in 12th house
*And in Synastry- My Chiron RIsing (asc in Taurus) sits in his 12th house)
*Also in synastry- my 12th house Juno in Taurus also sits in his 12th house)
*Also in synastry- my Vesta conjunct NN in Gemini are the degree right before his Ascendant.
What to make of this? Was our purpose to heal each other? But also to wound each other? Because that’s what it feels like!
Sorry, I can’t respond to lists of aspects. So much more needs to be considered.
Thank you very much Dawn. yeah, i think we didn’t invest much efforts in getting/staying together…however, when I tried to pursue more, I felt as if I was more needy and I cared more about this relationship, as his respose to my efforts was quite blank and gruff. He just wanted to keep it physical until one of us gets married with someone else. He didn’t want to commit/marry. This secrecy he is practising probably points to the venus-mars in composite twelfth ?
Dear Dawn,
What if the composite chart has two strong stelliums: one is made up of the outer planets in the 12th, the other – Sun/Mercy/Venus/Juno in the 10th (and moon and mars are in the 8th). Composite Saturn is in the 1st. Does that sound like enough “glue” to counter the 12th house effects?
The relationship is both a working one and personal/intimate.
Thank you in advance.
P.S. What gives a better idea of the relationship potential, synastry or composite? I noticed you don’t offer composite readings…
Outer planets have to do with things that are beyond our control. The inner planets are where we live–so yes, the 10th house stellium will have more influence on a day to day basis, and then once in a while the outer planets will come out to grab us with whatever their issues are, particularly by transit or progression to the stellium/12th.
Comparing composites to the biwheel between two charts is impossible, like comparing apples and oranges. The working dynamic of the partnership is in the biwheel (how do you make me feel?) but the composite chart provides the critical information of where a relationship is going and what are its advantages and disadvantages? Then you have to put the natal charts around the composite, and there are a number of other techiques depending on what questions are asked: coalescent charts, draconic charts, etc. The composite charts (both Davison and midpoint) need to be progressed. I do all these within a synastry consulation. It’s impossible to do one without composites or progressed composites.
Thrown/compelled into a private relationship that feels confusing and unavoidable at the same time. Beginning to look at our Composite Chart and come to find a Moon and Mars Conjunction in Leo 12th House. The Moon squares Mercury and Venus in the 9th, Pluto and Saturn in the 3rd, and squares the MC. Mars also squares Mercury, Venus, Pluto and Saturn. Moon and Mars both Trine Uranus. Looking at the chart, it seems to be propelling us into Aquarius, and Aquarian age type of love. Am I right in deducing that this relationship is more of an initiation? I feel there is no Karmic tie to this person, my intuition leans more towards twin flame type status. Any insight you may have would be extremely helpful, I am having difficulty understanding this 12th house energy.
thank you for this article, im really having a hard time understanding the 12th house, as you concluded we all do..
and i dont know why, this last paragraph brought a tear to my eye.. because it’s so true, so well said. (anyone who has ever fallen in love and had planets with that person in 12th composite will know..)
sounds pathetic, but thats just the nature of 12th house love; you cant downsize or decrease its feeling and meaning..
What a way to describe it ~ nebulous, yet mysteriously powerful influence on our lives or my life as far as i know, this was exactly how I confused myself in this short and intense relationship with an ex. In our composite chart, Mars in 12th house Cancer square MC conjunct Mercury(10th) and the Sun, Venus(9th) & Mars square IC conjunct Saturn and Pluto(3rd). I had to spend years unlearning what love is to me and settle with how individuals differ in what we value in a relationship. Indeed, I felt the fear trampling along the edge with fear of insecurity. I can no longer approach love as wholeheartedly again.
Thanks so much Dawn. You have nailed my experience. I feel so relieved after reading it because I really thought i was crazy. I thought I had become delusional, making things up in my head.
I had a relationship with someone, in our composite chart, we have a stellium in the 12th house – Sun, Juno, Venus and Uranus. I mentioned Juno because it has a 1 degree conjunction with the Sun. The relationship only lasted a few months but for some reason it has left a deep-seated, soul-touching impression with me. The feelings I have are much deeper than lust and infatuation. In our synastry chart, we also have exact Chiron/Venus opposition. Our physical connection was addicting. It was emotional and intense, also warm and familiar at the same time. We tried to stop but we couldn’t be in the same room alone……I know it sounds nothing more than two horny people getting together but it really wasn’t the same..or was it?
Our situation was kind of complicated. In the end it was his choice to end it. I don’t know if he felt the same deep feelings but I know he was puzzled by the sex. He told me that had never happened to him before (referring to how we couldn’t control ourselves). i am deeply hurt but I am not angry with him. The ego thing is very true.
Thanks again,
Erin
I would very much like to ask a question about Sun opposition Neptune in a composite especially if it is found as double whammy in synastry.From what I have read from your articles that particular dynamic is extremely difficult to get a grasp of.However I am wondering what kind of effect would Pluto in the 12th trine Sun would have on that aspect in the composite which is also double whammy in synastry.Especially since Pluto is the ruler of the Ascendant and Jupiter,co-ruler of Pisces hits that angle.My question has to do with whether in this case the 1st house plays a heavy role in the chart and balances the chaotic power of Sun-Neptune or whether it is so fused with piscean energy that the plutonian core searching is not enough to get through the neptunian fog.I know that you should see the whole chart and that the question is a bit absurd but I think there is a pattern here and I would really like to know even your smallest bit of opinion on the matter.Thank you in advance.
I’m sorry, Kyveli, but this is too complex a question to answer in the space here.
I have read your response about 12th house and i really do agree with you. I have 3 planets in my natal chart in 12th house (mercury,sun,mars) and we have 2 planets,which are identical in my natal(mercury and sun), in the composite chart in 12th house with someone who i talked for 6 months but we never dated.We also have our moon in pisces in 6th house. I don’t know why but i love him so much and sometimes I come up with things like dreaming of him to call me after a while he calls me. etc. Our ascendant is also pisces but our Uranus-Venus opposite position makes lots of deals in our relationship besides the 12th and 6th house. I cannot think, sleep since i met him. I don’t know whether this situation is karma? or sth. We have experienced together so much and it helps my mental developement so much and also your idea about ‘loving and letting go’ interests me a lot. I cannot really make that happen now I don’t know why but I’m still thinking that he is my faith or not, everything is very confused. I cannot be happy with him (I feel happy but it doesn’t last any longer) or without him. I don’ know what to do. I am very confused in everything in my life just because of him and the energies. What should i do? let go or fight for it? Am i trapping my self? Please enlighten me..
Usually, when the 12th house is heavily involved, whether it be a natal chart, a comparison, or a composite, the message is to let go. Neptune tries to tell us that we can’t own anything permanently, and if we try to possess and not understand the message of universal love (love is its own reward) it will pry our grasping fingers off of whatever we are trying to hold on to. Also, I would think that the answer to your issues is not in the composite, but in your natal comparison. Venus/Uranus is difficult in the composite, but it doesn’t explain your obsession. Neptune causes us to turn our ‘other’ into gods.
Dear Dawn,
Happy holidays and thank you for this article. I am surprised I did not find it and comment earlier, as I am still haunted by the same relationship 2 years after it ended.
The fellow and I have composite sun/Mercury conjunct in the 12th, making an out of sign conjunction to the ascendant. Neptune is also in the 12th, but hanging back a bit and squaring Neptune- yikes.
I have gone through a long, long cycle of heartaches and have been able to slowly, heart-wrenchingly get over each and every one, except this guy. In fact, it seems we are even more a part of each other’s lives than ever. I might even say he’s one of the closest people to me.
I was with him longer than I’ve ever consecutively been with someone- 1 1/2 years. When we split up I cried every day for a month. I felt like someone kicked me out of my home.
We could look at each other and read one another’s minds, but not in a way where you hear words or anything. Just a “knowing” if you will.
We are mainly connected by a love of art, music and film. Sometimes walking around with him is just like being in a movie, which is funny because we ARE in a movie together- one he is making with his best friend.
I am a strong 12th houser myself and it meant so much to me that we could live together and I never felt my precious solitude was infringed upon. That I could be around someone and not feel uncomfortable. It’s pretty rare.
The Mars/Neptune square did bring an element of slipperiness, but mostly irritating fibbing on his part. I think the fact that we’re both artists gave this aspect an outlet.
I didn’t see him for a year after we split up and then ran into him last year out of nowhere. I was immediately flooded with emotion- I realized all at once how intensely close to him I was and needed to know if he was ok, etc. I am NOT usually like this. At all. AT ALL.
Since then we got closer and closer and couldn’t hold back our attraction. While separated from his girlfriend and in the final stages of breaking it off with her, we had several secret liaisons- more 12th house.
He eventually ended it because he was afraid we’d go into a dark place with each other again- our relationship was very intense, and my insecurities and control issues combined with his youthful sloppiness are what destroyed it.
I was heart broken all over again. Here we are, older, everything so different now, lessons learned, and I am seeing that I can’t undo the past. I can’t stop the regretful feelings.
So here is my actual astrology question:
I am a strong 12th house person- the sun in Libra conjunct Pluto/Mercury in Scorpio, with Saturn in Scorpio widely conjunct my Scorpio ascendent (I told you I was intense…) and he has no planets in the 12th.
In synastry, his Pluto is in my 12th conjunct my ascendent tightly, and I have nothing in his 12th.
Is this why I am feeling this more? Unable to forget it? More appreciative of that special melding? He seems very able to detach himself and move to the future. I am sufficiently haunted.
As Jeff Buckley puts it, he’s “a tear that hangs inside my soul forever”.
Thank you for reading and I hope this story helps reveal more about the 12th house in composites…
I would need a full synastry to really answer your question. The composite chart only reveals so much–comparing natal charts tells us about the day to day of the people involved, their reactions to one another, their attractions, etc. His Pluto on your Ascendant is an intense experience, but it sounds as though Neptune is the culprit as far as you’re concerned. Forget about where his planets fall in your houses and instead, put your natal chart around the chart of the composite, then do the same with his. It might hold your answers, if you know how to read it properly.
Dawn, I just found this and it seems to hold some answers about what is going wrong with my marriage of 8 years. My wife and I have composite moon in the 12 house (aquarius). We also have composite venus in the 12th house. I have my sun in the 12th house of my natal chart, and we both have venus in the 12th house of our natal charts.
Several weeks ago, my wife revealed that she has been hiding a secret life of crushes and short-lived affairs from me over the past 4 years. She has great remorse about it and is seeking help to try and put an end to it. She says that she has been uncertain about her attraction to me from the beginning and is just really confused because she does love me. Through counseling she has discovered that her pattern of deception and maintaining an emotional distance from me stems from childhood. I have always been very attached to her and have had strong needs for physical intimacy which she has resisted. There is a lot of love between us, much alignment in our dreams and life goals and a feeling of being soul mates and yet a strange disconnect emotionally that has us often feeling like we are on completely different wavelengths. Oh, and we have a 7 year old son.
I am in a very confused place myself right now, wanting to forgive, still loving her, but not understanding her and whether healing her childhood wounds will bring her attraction back, or if it’s got something more to do with me and something I need to let go of. I met her near the end of my Saturn return (Cancer in the 4th house) and I am aware of deep wounds in me around my need for nurturing and I wonder if my neediness in this area may have something to do with it all. I often was a bit too demanding of her when it comes to intimacy and I wonder if this is about me learning to let go. So much uncertainty and confusion!!
Any insight you can offer would be greatly appreciated. I am at a point where I’m in limbo and ready to let go if necessary, but I am paralyzed by the confusion and inability to understand what’s at the root of what led us to this point. I can’t make a decision of whether to stay or leave without more clarity… it feels like we aren’t done learning what we need to learn together, but staying together in this state where she doesn’t desire me is agony.
I’m afraid that you would need a full synastry reading in order to make sense of the situation for you and your wife. It’s more complex than just the composite positions.
12th House seems to be the most frightening of all the houses to me, because the primal urge towards each other is such a deep and profoundly spiritual one, that you think, there’s no way I could find this depth with another. And you may then limit yourself for years, into oblivion. Even the sexual draw of 8th house connections can be replaced by more of them down the road, or by the excitement of the 5th. But exploring worlds during sex, soul bonding, feeling understood at a deep level, feeling at home in the spirit of the world, higher purpose together, channeling together, these are all things ive felt with my boyfriend and our 12th house energies. I am a pisces sun, mercury, mars. He is a pisces rising with neptune conjunct his midheaven.
In synastry, I have my sun, mercury, and mars in his 12th house in pisces, and his venus in my 12th house in cancer/gemini. We also have Sun conjunct Saturn, Saturn trine Moon double whammy, Sun conjunct North Node double whammy, his venus conjunct my ascendant, My Mercury conjunct his ascendant, our moons conjunct in aries, Sun opposite Sun, Mercury opposite Mercury, and Venus opposite Venus, all within 3 degrees. Thats for start.
In the Davison, we have Saturn, Moon, Pluto, and Venus Conjunct in the 12th house. Sun/Uranus conjunct in the 1st. In the composite only our venus and moon are conjunct in the 12th.
Obviously, I thought this man was my soulmate. But someone who tells you they love you every day and tries to break up with you every month is clearly not. Im in hawaii for a month, after he broke up with me for the last time, trying to get my strength and sanity back and assure myself that you should not have to TRY so hard for things to work, when these 12th issues come up to work on. For him, its TOO many of his own issues. His north node in his 12th in pisces which means he will have to travel from a more material existence to a spiritual one in his lifetime, but that could take another 20 years. All that subconscious provoking of each other is very much a full time job and its preventing me from being successful in life and meeting a man that can offer the support i need to really fly. 12th house issues are not always supportive. They rip the rug from under you every other day.
Women may stay because they think, how the heck am i going to find a man I’m this connected to?
All that positive Saturn synastry for durablilty, moon conjunction, and all those personal planet oppositions make us feel like the same person sometimes.
Who cares? It doesnt matter. If you don’t like how someone operates, who cares how connected you are to them?
Trust me when I say that I will happily take a man i am less “connected” to, to allow myself the support I need to thrive in this life.
Its a damn shame, but I cant make him more a more spiritual person, just because our powerful connection together is deep and spiritual.
Dear Dawn, thank you for this amazing article.
Me and my friend have composite sun conj. mercury and mercury conj. venus all in the 12th house.
We get along very well but our relationship is being kept in secret (which sucks) and the Saturn and Pluto opposite Asc. scares me a bit. Should I pay attention to that or to our individual charts?
I read our full synastry report, using dual cosmodynes, and the outcome was very positive and harmonic, scoring pretty much above the average!
So my final question is which method should I look onto (composite or synastry) as they both seem to go into totally different directions…and is it possible to reveal our secret relationship even with composite 12th house?
There are lots of couples with heavy 12th house influence who are out in the open. Nothing in astrology dictates your decisions. In my experience, if you have a good synastry but a difficult composite, the couple get along with one another but have problems establishing the relationship in the outside world.
Thanks a lot Dawn, now I understand it.
Greetings
Hi Dawn,
How does the 12th manifest when the planet is also conjunct the Asc? For instance I have a Composite Taurus Sun at 1-2 degrees in the 12th Conjunct Taurus Eros (also in the 12th at 4 degrees), and the Taurus Asc at 5 degrees. There is also Mercury in Taurus at 12 degrees, but this is in the 1st. My takeaway is that the two people involved would think the relationship was hidden (and something for just them) but it’s not really because of the nature of the Asc Conjunctions. There is also a Mars in the 12th that doesn’t get really any support from anything. What is your thought on this. Thanks.
You can’t really know how an aspect is going to manifest without looking at the whole chart, but it is true that conjunctions from the 12th house side are very complex. The 12th house doesn’t necessarily mean hidden. It can also mean, in this case, unconscious elements making themselves known via the Ascendant in mysterious ways. We don’t really ‘grasp’ what’s in the 12th until we spiritualize it, remove the ego from the planet’s function. Mercury in the first is a good aspect to have because of the communication involved and the ability to think clearly regarding the relationship. However, Eros in the 12th may mean a less conscious eroticism drives the relationship–we think we know what we’re doing but we may not, and may be subject to desires of all kinds. Mars in the 12th can mean unconscious eroticism, aggression, or desire. How that manifests depends on other aspects.
Hi Dawn, are you able to give me anymore insight or know where I might find more information about 12th house stellium in cancer planets are sun,moon,Mercury and Venus in my husband and my composite chart. Also my moon is conjuct to his sun both ways. I’m also interested in anything about twin flame relationships. By the way loved your above article and thank you for any info you provide : ) x
Thanks for writing this article. I have been so confused and you describe it so accurately. We have a composite 12th house sun mars and venus in Cancer! In my natal I have mars and mercury in 12th house Gemini.
We have had such a difficult relationship. I have learned to surrender much but our relationship isnt surviving, we cant let go altogether and cant seem to be together. what can we do here? What is the best approach? There are two conjunctions with ascendent as well. Any advice would be helpful. Gilly
I can’t really comment without seeing the charts. One or two aspects, especially in composite, do not carry the story.
Hello dawn
The part about unrequited love was particularly interesting and that other part might not know what we exist. I’m always attracted to those types of “relationships”
me and this guy who don’t know each other properly have same ascendants and house cusps natally. My mars falls in his 12th and his moon falls in my 12th. And we both natally have same aspects, my mars is in my 12th and his moon is in his 12th also. In composite we have north node in 12th. we activate each others 1st, 2nd, 3rd, 4th, 6th, 10th and 11th houses also. how this would manifest? where is very intense connection and I can feel things you’ve described but also I can see it as long term..
Most of it is illusions I know.. Most of my “relationships” are like that 😀
Sorry, Natalia, I can’t really comment on this in the space available. The 12th house is always complex and is different in how it manifests depending on the contacts involved.
Aghh! My boyfriend and I have 4-5 planets in the 12th house in our composite progressed chart. But yes, the karmic and telepathic feelings are all there. This makes so much sense. Just not what I wanted to hear. 🙁
Can you say anything on the north node transiting the twelfth house on a composite? The south node lies there on the natal composite.
It’s time to clean up the karma between you, according to the position of the Nodes in the composite chart.
Found the site while trying to decipher a stellium in a composite 12th house. Interesting description: it seems like we’ve followed ourselves around the country for each of our lives and not ever taking the time to learn about each other. We’ve known each other for a decade??? and he JUST asked me to lunch yesterday. Pluto, Sun, Venus & Mercury in the 12th/Virgo. Jupiter in 1st house, Uranus in the 11th to bracket the party. Mars & NNode in Cancer/10th. Moon in Aries/7th, Saturn in the 5th/Aquarius. Comfy date, lots of laughter, he contacted me for a second date. I feel ok about it but don’t want to attach to it. Curious about the sexual response (if there will be anything), it’s friendly. I’m not wanting to drag him to the floor – yet. I just am hesitating. Thoughts on this combo would be greatly appreciated by me. I’m kinda tired of dancing with men who enjoy attempting control and am tired of the endlessly unavailable creatures that keep crossing my path in life.
Impossible to comment without seeing both charts.
Hey Dawn! Your article is amazing! I found so many answers and maybe some dissapointments as well :/
I met with a guy 2 months ago and when we saw each other, -there is no doubt that- we were both fascinated by each other. Our date was perfect but too creepy cause he told his very deep secrets and early regrets to me. No one could share that kind of information with a person that he/she newly know. His sun scorpio falls into my fourth house in my natal chart and mine ,cancer, falls into his 8th. Besides, his vertex conjunct with my sun and oppose w/ my moon. Mine is conjunct with his moon. I thought that because of the 8th house or vertex, I forced him to confront his own dark side.
However, when I examine our composite chart, I was shocked. We have Sun,mercury,venus and jupiter in 12th house virgo. Our mars is in cap in 3rd house and mars in 11th house libra. That is really challenging chart I assume and I don’t know whether I go for this guy or not. He also has 12th house stellium in his own natal chart in Scorpio. We are just in the beginning so should I try this relationship or just let it go?
By looking your article I realized that our composite chart is too difficult to try a relationship but when I examine our natal charts, there are many matchings as well…
The examination of two natal charts shows how people interact with one another==how I affect you, and vice versa. However, what happens when we join together as a couple/entity is reflected in the composite chart. Some relationships have terrible natal comparisons and good composites. It also works the other way. Synastries (especially composite charts) are complicated and if confused (or you feel threatened) you should consult a professional.
Dawn, thank you for writing this article. I have a heavily involved 12th house with someone, in synastry, sun and sun/moon in each other natal and composite.shows Sun/Mar/Saturn. The relationship has been on & off, again and again for 28 years. It has left a hole in my heart, (composite chiron conjunct asc) and I suffered from insomnia regretting I should or shouldn’t have done. Noticed he has moved on and I want to let go and move on too, hoping that the story will not repeat itself again. But my heart and mind keep telling me to fight again. My concern is a grand trine in the composite chart, Mercury/Jupiter/Venus all conjunct in the 1st (pisces) trine Moon/North node conjunct in the 5th (cancer) and Neptune the chart ruler in the 9th (Scopio). Are these water houses the culprits that keep pulling me back? Another concern is his Saturn and North node in my MC/IC and my Mercury/Mar (ruler of my 7th) in his Asc. Aren’t these positive aspects good enough to sustain a relationship down-to-earth, telling me to forgive and try again or just simply blowing the matter worse and prolonging it?. Please forgive me, there are much to read and ask, Your inputs will be very much appreciated.
I’m sorry, but all of the aspects you mentioned can be used as excuses to pull you back into a relationship that has ended for the other person: in particular, the trines. When Saturn is conjunct the North Node it can be particularly ruthless in pursuing its goals. That may mean leaving you behind.
Hi! My english is not very good. Im from a country in southamerica. I read your article and its really touching! Ive recently broke up with what was felt “the love of my life” the most pure and locvng relationship ever. But i ran of him, i really dont understand why, it makes me feel so sad. My natal venus is in the 12 th house. Our composite has a sun and north node in the 12 th house. But venus, mars, moon and vertex in the first house in pisces. I dont know why im writing you this because uncounsciously know this relationship was all about love and let go. So sad! Thank you for your insight
Thank you SO very much for this post. It is SO powerful! I am 38 years old and have a Scorpio 12th house stellium (Sun, Moon, Mars, Mercury, and Neptune) so I am painfully, and blissfully, intimately aware of this energy. I can say with absolute confidence that you perfectly captured the essence of this energy. Loving and letting go, as well as maturing your love into a transcendant form of love where you are able to love so deeply that you give it the potential to annihilate you, yet you learn to let go and allow the natural changes in the state of our being has been a reoccurring theme of my life. The 12th house really gives you an opportunity to see behind the veil in such a powerful and beautiful way, to understand not only our existence in this lifetime, but our collective reason and the inner workings of the universe itself and the karmic bonds that we have formed with soul family that have traveled this journey with us for many many lifetimes.
this is honestly so beautiful to read. I don’t know if what we have count as a “heavy 12th house” but we have our north nodes in the 12th with vesta in virgo, and our south nodes in the 6th with the vertex in pisces. i give it much meaning because i really feel a psychic connection and a karmic fate, but again that could be just me since i have a heavy neptune but nothing in my natal 12th. i imagine these aspects can point to a past life where there was dominance in the work field isuees? however, we are very well aspected with neptune in trine and sextile to our nodes, as our sun, but our vertex is opposed and conjucted. do you have any clue of what this means or should i just ignore it?
I have a 12th house Capricorn stellium and my husband and I also have a composite 12th house Capricorn stellium. We both feel we have been together over many lifetimes. We share the same dreams, communicate telepathically, had a fated “magnetic” meeting; we are truly best friends. He knows me better than I know myself at times. We challenge each other to be the best versions of ourselves. We have Uranus, Mercury, Neptune, Saturn, North Node, Sun in the 12th. Saturn, NN, and Sun exact at 28 degrees, opposite Chiron Rx in Cancer. Jupiter Rx in the 7th in Leo. Aquarius rising at 29 degrees. I’m not exactly sure what our “future” holds, but I do know we are exactly where we are supposed to be 🙂 XOXO ~ Thank you for the lovely insights!!!
Such a great article! What would you say about a composite Scorpio Juno in the 12th house, conjunct to the asteroid Valentine and squaring the north and south node? It’s also trine to the moon and sextiling Uranus. I’m so confused by this mix!
We met 3 months ago, and live 300 miles apart. We have met up a few times since then, but our feelings for each other were immediate and are exceptionally strong even without the benefit of an active physical relationship. His 12th is in Pisces, along with his Sun, Mercury, Venus and Mars. My 12 is in Leo, along with my Sun, Mercury, Mars and Pluto. I also have two stelliums in the 11th and 12th of my natal chart….a total of 8 planets (6 in Leo).
Our Composite Sun, Mercury, Venus, Mars and Jupiter are in the 12th, Gemini. Neptune is in the 4th, Libra.
Since each of us share a natal 12th house dominion, then repeated in a shared composite strength, what you have said in your 12th house explanations all seem to feel so true. However, with so much 12th house a individuals, and then as a couple, can there be something more than “We are fated, but we are meant to part. We have a meaningful journey to take together, but we must ultimately be alone. ” ?
I retire in one year and will be living 20 miles from him. We are each in our mid 60’s…he never married, and I (a widow) married 25 years…to a Pisces. PS.. he’s the very first guy I ever met who knew and talked about astrology! He literally proposed to me the night we met.
Have you any thoughts or words to share on the 12th house commonalities we have individually, and what impact it lends to us as a couple? Fated, for sure, but lessons to learn, or something that we must finish? Or … ?
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I need help! My husband and I have composite sun conjunct Saturn in the 12th, composite moon conjunct Venus in the 1st. We are happy when we’re together but he took a job 2 hours away and moved into our country house which I have now come to hate. He is my best friend but marriage to him has been so disappointing because there’s not much difference between now and when I was single. (We’re married 16 years, and now we are old!) My progressed Uranus will be in my 7th house for the rest of my life. Is there nothing better to hope for?
You’re a poet of poets. You’re writing is inspired. And I learned a lot too. Thank you.
I have 12th house with my partner, but also many Saturn and Pluto Aspects. Together we share a Mars 12th. But, separate he has a Saturn Gemini 12th and I have a Mercury Scorpio 12th. Will we stay together after we have learned our lesson together? Because, of Saturn and Pluto? Our strongest aspect is Saturn Trine Moon.
Wow… very insightful thank you so much, I love your writing!! My husband and I, have composite Saturn 27 Pluto 28 Libra in 12th, forming a T square to our Sun 26 Cancer and Venus 19/Mercury 23 Capricorn. The empty space… in Aries, would that be the outlet or where to focus all that energy? I say empty.. no planet but Asteroid Osiris is 26 Aries.
I hope you are well during these strange and powerful times
Hi Dawn,
A share a composite chart with a stellium of planets (Sun, Mercury, Uranus, and Neptune) in the 12th house with cusp on Scorpio. So, the composite Venus and Saturn are also in the 12th house. This person and I believe we’re soulmates, and I would go further to say we’re twin flames as we share some many parallels in our lives, similarities, and all the other strange features of a twin flame relationship as describe by many.
Do you think perhaps it’s just the heavily dominated 12th house of our composite chart that’s responsible for my belief that we may be twin flames?
Sorry Shannon, Dawn passed away a couple of years ago. Maybe someone else on the page will have an answer for you.
I have composite sun and moon in house 12 with my brother. We both have natal moon in house 12. We also have 3 composite planets and an asteroid in house 8. We went through hell together, we loved each other, we saved each other, we saved others together, we could practically feel and read one another. We were happy plutonicay together. I loved him from the bottom of my heart. Then we hurt each other. Now we hate each other and nothing made sense. I haven’t spoken to him in a couple of years and my heart is still broken. I fell onto another man after that whom I had a very deep dark sexual connection to and whom I shared a heavy 8th composite chart with. A very painful and challenging connection. 8th and 12th house seem to have haunted me for most of my life 🙁
This only made me sad and hopeless…